Mak Jo Si or Tin Yat Lineage Taoism Q and A

Many people were criticizing Tin Yat Lineage or me and my lineage or even my students. I want to use this thread to welcome FRIENDLY posting of questions or doubts or anything which I or my students will answer (ONLY if you are coming for real discussion.). I am making this approach because I do NOT want people to fuck around me and making stuff up just because I am not talking in their little circles. If you got questions, say it here. I will face your questions upfront.

The thing I want to also mention is - in this thread you will hear what Mak Jo Si or his student will say and these are all our opinions, views, or knowledge, or whatever you call that. But we DO NOT mean to convince, convert or tell anyone to follow my way or my theories. I am JUST telling you what and why we think and say those things. So, yes, you can disagree, and so just skip my post if you like. But if you got questions you want me to answer, welcome to post. I am not going to debate, I am just posting, quoting and answering -- to clear confusion.

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1) Re: ll Religions Are Bad

One thing that I always hear is that people are criticizing the point that I am saying all religions are bad and stuff. Well ya, that is true, I do not agree to many religions, so what? I have my reasons and I don't give a shit if you don't agree with me too, and when do you see I post those things on TTB or anywhere not MY place to convince people eh?  I just post things on my OWN websites, and if you don't like it, leave, simple enough? But now I want to ask, how many of you actually remember Christianity say everything other than their almighty god... is demonic?  Also, that Allah god of Muslim is the same... Why don't you go F them back and say they are bullshit? How come no one seems to have a problem with that?


2) Tao Guns

I saw the most recent talk on TTB about our Tao Guns magic and they are criticizing it. Here I want to ask you guys, why don't people criticize how the other Taoist sect using swords for their Taoist magic? Or even some other religions have tons of weapons for those things too, daggers, swords, axe, and so on. Why guns is a problem? Taoism is about nature, and not being "old fashion".  Technology is part of nature's advancement, and if you talk about swords in the Han Dynasty, that is something very trendy and up to fashion too, and so how come they are okay back then?  If your Taoism is real deal, then of course it can blend with anything else you can find in the modern days. That's what Tin Yat Lineage teach and also is capable of doing. If others cannot do it, doesn't mean we cannot. If you haven't tried it, do not criticize, because you don't know about anything I teach.  I suggest, you should ask my students or see their testimonials, and those are people who witness Tin Yat Lineage's magic and see the true Taoist magic power.

3) Service and Taoism FU for money

This is the biggest bullshit I ever heard - people are criticizing that I am charging too much money for this and that. Okay, come on guys, that "immortal' guy on TTB had harassed me before on another forum just because I do not agree with him and he seeks for revenge back in TTB later on, what an ass!  He and others are trying to say I am charging too much for whatever FUs I sell and so on, stuff need to be free etc... bullshit!  ---  Hell, I work full time as a Taoist master, run a real 1600 sq/ft temple and also have to pay for rent myself to live and eat and so on. I devote my whole life to Taoism and that is the one and only one career I am doing... if everything is free, how can I sustain in business?  Do you guys here go to work for FREE?  Just because some people are greedy and always want free stuff doesn't mean I have to give free things.  Now here is the fun part you want to know...

On my Taoist Master Blog, I had put up tons of FREE materials you can learn on your own (Taoist Magic, some kungfu and so on). Well if you want to try self-help, those are free, welcome to try. If you want to have me do things for you, I charge you money. Just like you want to get a plumber to fix the pipe for you, they charge you money. Simple enough right? How come now Mak Jo Si have to work for free when he is a real guy with a real storefront working full time with this career and other people who work as PART TIME Taoist can charge anything they want and still be "generous"? I mean, do you know how much Mantak Chia charge people to go to learn @ his resort? I heard from a guy before who went, $80k for a year, ya, $80k. What about those Jerry A J books? $200 a book JUST to know about some stuff they do and you don't actually learn anything from reading it, and those are okay. Um, ya!

4) Taoism FU, Too Expensive?

Taoism FU is not just a piece of paper, and those who think it is, they are just too shallow and selfish. Taoism FU requires years and months of training to get it to work or have the power to work or be effective. It's like saying, oh that is just a piece of painting, how come it can cost $3000?  It's just ink and canvas or some pen marks!  Well if you look at things that way, I can't help you realize anything.... right?  Ya, your cheapass mindset will lead you to nothing but a horrible life because you do not know how to appreciate the hard work people put into their work, cuz you never put any effort into your own work maybe?  Damn, tell an artist this - can I just buy you a box of pencils and paper and you can draw for me?  It's cheaper that way. LOL!

5) Certs and shit

Honestly, I am sick and tired of those CERTS BUYING SHIT. Why? Because when I got scammed by Luk Yam sect before, I was connected with a branch in Hong Kong and I know how they do corruption with the gov in China and shit. Zhen Yi sect and Quan Zhen Sect HEAD / lineage holders were in the corruption, that Bin Ladin looking guy who run the white cloud temple IS very corrupted. Everyone knows in Asia, if they are involved in Taoism. The China's Taoist ASSHOLEciation was created for this purpose --> to fuck all the sects down and so the gov's propaganda can long live and control over religion in China. You know why they have the Taoist passport and certs selling thing?  Because they want MONEY, corruptions is famous in China don't you know that?  I don't pay respect to Quan Zhen Sect and Zhen Yi sect in China today, because I don't lick the gov's ass and I don't think that is a good idea either. A true taoist do not bow down to these things. Only the fakers does. Oh yes, that picture that JAJ shown with the guy beside him in Dragon Tiger Gate? My ex-luk yam master and his branch all bribed him big time, pouring tons of money over. About $3k USD from each student who want a better cert, and $300 for entry certs, and they gather up a BIG chunk of money to pay this guy then your exam there become magically EASY.  They ask you a few questions and your exam is over -- while some people get a longer one because they pay less. LOL!  It's all about fame, name and having a better looking temple with certs hanging on the wall so you can CHARGE PEOPLE MORE.

Hey guys, you know how much a cert-holding Zhen Yi Sect taoist charge people in Taiwan for doing a ritual? $12000 for one session, oh ya, USD. It's mostly for funeral or some big rituals, and ya, one news on Youtube say a young girl who got those certs in Taiwan earn about $1,200,000 taiwanese dollar a year after all the expenses... and that is a normal rate. Higher you go, I mean.. more money you spend on certs from this and that sect, you can earn more and charge more.

Hey guys, WELCOME TO TAOISM!  Why don't you guys say those are scammers but me? huh?  My prices are under-charge and not even in those standard!   No one got a problem with those certs buying temples because they are what, OLD?  Gov approved? Corruption-operated?  No one cares right?

DO NOT TELL ME TO RESPECT THESE CORRUPTION SHIT SECTS, because I have had enough and I saw it myself and almost fall for it myself. Luckily I was out of that shit. Now I am debunking this and that cuz I saw it myself and you guys all don't know this because how many people even know about the real Taoism world on TTB anyway? All those that the people know are the gwai-lo targeting stuff, but not the real world in Asia... sigh.  You cannot imagine HOW corrupted it is in Asia now. But ya, if you don't believe, sure, skip my post, I do NOT debate or argue with anyone.

Hello Everyone

This is my first post on this forum and i wanted to comment about Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si and Chi In Nature.

I have practiced martial arts and chi kung for 35 years, but i do not have any experience with Taoism at all. After finding chi in nature and Mak Jo Si I have been amazed at them and their web sites!

First of all is Mak Jo Si's passion and love for Taoism is evident! If i have had any question or trouble or inquiry he has responded with depth and candidness in such a wonderful and heartening way! Literally he will reply within hours usually MINUTES! That shows his caring and love of Taoism and the passion he has for it!

If you had any doubt about Mak Jo Si or Lau Jo Si and Chi in nature and Tin Yat Taoism my advice is only to go check out the web sites or any of his students web sites! IT IS AMAZING! Literally  they have 1,000 of pages on every aspect of Taoism there for all to read for free! And on every subject Philosophy, Fung Shui, Magic, Kung Fu, Taiji and much much more! In fact just the basics and Tao lessons 1-10 they have on there I learned more in those pages than 35 years of training in internal arts!! And i am not joking! I thought i knew what baat gwa and yin yang and the I ching was!! I did not! But with Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si and Tin Yat Taoism and this fantastic site I have learned that and so much more for free!! And Mak Jo Si has kindly and patiently with humor and seriousness helped me w any stumbling block i had along the way through his web site!!

Now if this were all i would still be very happy with Mak Jo Si and his Tin Yat Taoism BUT theres MORE! They have 100's of tutorials and videos on every subject posted there for free online! AMAZING! If you think you know Taoism after just viewing a fraction of the material Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si have up you will surely understand a lacking in your own knowledge about the religion and Taoism on the whole as I did!

The coolest thing I have found with Mak Jo Si so far is his passion for sharing what he feels is truth! He openly shares what he found to be false in Taoism that he studied and mastered, but he also shares how he and Lau Jo Si fixed it! The litmus test for each of them is that its true and it works! No evil or con artistry or charlatanism allowed. Mak Jo Si even goes so far as to share how who and why these other so called Taoist groups fake and con their believers!! Debunking them on his web sites and even calling them on any BS they have! This shows integrity and a deep love for Taoism and Truth!

This dedication and hard work coupled with the free sharing of information, the help for spreading this knowledge of Tin Yat Taoism, and the fact that this is their full time profession!! Make Mak Jo Si, Lau Jo Si and Chi In Nature in my opinion THE ONLY logical place to study and learn real Taoism!

Best wishes to all my Tao family
Chris Arnold
Desert Dao Center

Mak Jo Si is doing a great job, and what he writes on THEIR website is nobodys business. Mak Jo Si has ebunked alot of fake sh*t and this will hopefully help alot of people not getting scammed by those people.
I fully agree with Mr Arnold, and wrote my opinion earlier on this forum, glad to be here

Thanks to Chris and Ulf for showing up too! You two also teach martial arts (kung fu) but both of you also learn from me! I am sure if we meet up one day we will have a nice sparring day! LOL!

I will have to train harder in that case...!!! o.O hahaha

i can't believe this guy already has 4 accounts here and is spamming massive walls of text



does work here? o.O

First off, I would like to say hello to all.

The following is fairly long, but I think it is important for anyone who wants to know more about the actual facts
about Mak Jo Si and his 'Taoist sect' to read through the following. I have actually left out some details to try to
keep this shorter. There are a number of facts that people should be aware of however.
Note: I have the actual web links from which I took the quotes from Mak Jo Si below, but it seems that since
I am a new member I am not able to include web links in my posts for another 7 days. If anyone wants the
actual web links where the following quotes were taken from, I will have to wait till account has the priveleges to do so.


I would like to start by commenting on some of the posts that are being made in this forum by Mak Jo Si and some of his followers. I have communicated with Wilson Yong a few times through email over the past few years in regards to questions I had about Taoist services he provides through his website, and also in regards to general questions I had. Although he is often extremely busy, Wilson Yong has always taken time to reply to my emails and get back to me. He is always very polite and very professional, and it is obvious from his replies that he is genuinely concerned with trying to help people and I have seen no indications at all that he has any interest in trying to cheat anyone or cause problems for anyone. He makes very little money from the Taoist services he provides through his website, and appears to just provide these Taoist services mainly as a way to help people out who may need some of the services he is able to provide.

Prior to Mak Jo Si starting his web attacks against various Taoist sects and many other religions, I had never ever come across any complaints against Wilson Yong or the Taoist services he has been providing through his website over the years. A couple of years ago approximately I noticed that Mak Jo Si began to post attacks against various religions and Taoist and Buddhist sects. Mak Jo Si's attacks were for the most part quite ridiculous, basically following the pattern that if he or someone he knew or heard of by hearsay ever encountered anyone who was supposedly associated with some religion or sect or whatever who did something wrong, Mak Jo Si would declare the whole religion or sect or group a scam or fraud or evil! Clearly Mak Jo Si has some serious issues, as he is not able to see how completely faulty the logic is that he has been using to attack and label basically all religions and sects that aren't his own 'sect' as scams and evil. I should also point out that Wilson Yong is not involved in any way in some of the stuff that Mak Jo Si has been going on about in regards to people slicing them self with knives and cleavers and that sort of thing. This has nothing to do with what Wilson Yong does or the services he provides.

When I became aware in the last little while that Mak Jo Si was launching a major attack campaign against Wilson Yong on the internet, I did a search on Wilson Yong's name and found that a whole bunch of blogs and such had appeared on the internet under various names which were launching all sorts of attacks against Wilson Yong and calling him a 'scammer' and 'fraud' and all sorts of other names and accusations. Most of these blogs seems to be repeating or rehashing a lot of the attacks being put out by Mak Jo Si against Wilson Yong, and many seem to be in the exact same writing style and even with the exact same sort of bad grammar and manner of expression and that sort of thing. Based on this, it seems pretty likely that many of these attack blogs that have sprung up, if not all of them, against Wilson Yong are either by Mak Jo Si himself, or by some of his followers or associates. This is not to say that there are not weird or even evil cults out there that associate them self to Taoism or other religions, as we all know that there are such cults appearing from time to time, but to label most major religions and many main stream sects of Taoism and Buddhism as all 'cults' or 'scammers' or 'evil' as Mak Jo Si is doing is quite frankly just plain ridiculous.

Now let's be clear here. For a so called 'Taoist Master', as Mak Jo Si portrays himself as, to be attacking and making many disparaging remarks against many other religions and sects, is just by itself so counter to Taoist principles and traditions, that most reasonable people right off would realize that something is very wrong with Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si and their supposed 'Taoist sect' and claims to be 'Taoist Masters'. Many different Taoist sects with many different views and practices have coexisted throughout China's history and such attacks by such Taoists against other Taoist sects are pretty much unheard of. There is a reason for this. True Taoists are concerned with providing Taoist services and assistance in various ways to the general public, and are also involved with their own self cultivation and practices. There is a basic principle in Taoism, which is also a major principle in many other religions as well, which is cultivating virtuous behaviour and actions and helping others. This is a common theme to spiritual cultivation and progression, and the requirements in this regard are always naturally much more stringent in regards to religious leaders and priests and monks and nuns from most religions, including Taoism. I have met real Taoist priests in person from a few different sects from China and Hong Kong and spent time with them , and was very impressed with their high degree of moral behavior they showed and stressed, and their deep commitment to being of service to others. For certain, none of these real Taoist priests were at all interested in running Taoism as a 'for profit business', nor did I ever hear any of them say any disparaging words against other Taoist sects or religions. Even when I asked for their opinions on other Taoist sects, they would just politely say something like Taoism involves different approaches and views and each has their own way, or they would just politely change the subject. Now compare what I have described here to Mak Jo Si, and what Mak Jo Si has been doing. He seems to never miss an opportunity to attack or disparage some other religion or some other Taoist or Buddhist sect or group or persons, and now seems to have launched a major smear campaign on the internet against various other sects and religions as well. This in no would be considered to be virtuous or spiritual behavior from even a lay follower of a Taoist or Buddhist sect, let alone acceptable behavior from a Taoist Priest or Buddhist monk. You can bet that if a member of a Taoist or Buddhist sect were behaving that way that such a person would be taken to task right away from leaders in their sect, and might well even be expelled for actions similar to what Mak Jo Si has been doing for several years now. Think about this carefully, and I am certain that anyone who is really familiar with various Taoist sects in Quanzhen or Zhen Yi Taoism would know that I am speaking the truth. Ethics and virtue by priests or monks, and even lay fololwers, etc. are given very high importance and taken very seriously.

If we also consider Mak Jo Si's obsession with guns and knives, and using guns on his alter and for part of his 'Taoist magic' rituals, it becomes more obvious that something is very wrong here. Look at Mak Jo Si's youtube video page (search on his youtube account name: chiinnature), and scan through his uploaded videos and you will see that it is full of videos about all kinds of pellet guns he has and even various types of knives and daggers. Very bizarre.

There is also a matter of Mak Jo Si posting on his web blog that the 'Luk Yam Shen Gong' Taoist sect just 'made up'
the Deity named 'Luk Yam Sin Si'. Here is the relevant quote from his blog:
quote:
====================================
"Luk Yam Shen Gong Sect now came up with a few versions of their history or so-called legend which they officially made up and agreed among all the branches and even paid some money for the Zhen Yi Sect in China and Taiwan to say the same thing and print out some fake history books to support their stupid legend. It just piss me off. Here are the versions of their “legends”.

a) Luk Yam was found by Luk Yam Sin Si (六壬仙師) who is an ancient deity, unknown history and people already lost the history of it during the time when war is all over the place. (yeah, good try, bloody good excuse like my dog ate my homework.)

b) Luk Yam Sin Si (again) started the whole thing and this person is a real person who is called Li Shun Fung 李淳風. He is hired by the king in the Tang Dynasty. He is specialized in astrology only and he believe in Taoism in his later age only. Can this be really the founder of a Taoism sect with magic? I don’t think so. He even worked with another guy called Yuen Tin Gong 袁天罡 who is also another specialist in astrology but believe in Muslim. Okay, Muslim, I can’t stand it anymore.

c) Luk Yam Sin Si is the founder and he is the guy who named 鬼谷子 (Gwai Guk Ji) in the ancient time, which we called the “spring autumn war era” that is way before the Chun Dynasty. This person is a military strategist and talented in astrology and stuff like that only, nothing related to magic at all. Now Zhen Yi Sect even went bullshit with these Luk Yam dudes and made some fake history books and claim it is a real true history. This is fucked up.

d) Some branches try to not mention these histories and just say they don’t know instead and remain quiet in this subject.

I give a like and thumbs up for the D) guys. A-C can go home and keep your bullsh*t to yourself. This is a scam, a fraud. Luk Yam is born after the Mao Shan Shen Gong or about the same period. How did Mao Shan Shen Gong started? "
====================================

Look at the language supposed Taoist Master Mak Jo Si is uing in the above quote from his blog. Yikes!

Now let's compare Mak Jo Si's statements above that 'Luk Yam Sin Si' is a made up Taoist Deity, to something Mak Jo SI wrote on his 'Chi In Nature' website several years ago when he started his first self proclaimed 'Taoist sect' which he called called "Ng Yin Do Pai".
Here is what Mak Jo Si wrote on his website back then:
quote:
====================
"During an evening of 2002's spring, Mak Tin-Si was training in front of the altar as he normally does. A flash of gold light suddenly loomed and unveiled an immortal ahead of Mak Tin-Si's eye. He is the grand master of a Taoism lineage. His name is "Luk Yam Sin Si"　六壬仙師.

Mak Tin-Si knelt down with great respect and awaited for grand master's instruction. After a few moments, grand master the Luk Yam Sin Si 　六壬仙師　begins to give instruction. He told Mak Tin-Si to look for a person who have a specific date of birth and time. Then they will open a store to host a temple while broadening out the word of Taoism. With many efforts and great assist from Luk Yam Sin Si　六壬仙師, Mak Tin-Si finally found this person in the year of 2003's summertime. This person is Lau Tin-Si. She is born with concealed potentially condensed Taoism energy. However, because she has not been properly attuned, for that reason the energy cannot be unleashed and used yet. She is the one who was specially put to be brought up in the westerly civilization to study and feel the western culture, religion and knowledge for future reference.

During the August of 2003, Mak Tin-Si and Lau Tin-Si trained in front of the altar as how they used to usually train. All of a sudden, a flash of gold light loomed again and Luk Yam Sin Si　六壬仙師 unveiled in the gold light. There were many more immortals and gods beside Luk Yam Sin Si 六壬仙師　this time. The scene is just so grand. Luk Yam Sin Si　六壬仙師 has attuned Lau Tin-Si and unlocked all the Taoism energy inside Lau Tin-Si. Luk Yam Sin Si　六壬仙師 granted her a Taoism name "Ng Faat" 悟法　and transferred a huge amount of Taoism energy to Lau Tin-Si. After the whole process, Luk Yam Sin Si 六壬仙師told Mak Tin-Si and Lau Tin-Si to train hard and try their best to spread out the word of Taoism in the coming days with the method of "poor training" without any whinnying or complain. From then, we were granted the name of Chi in Nature "NG YIN"　悟然 for our altar."

...

In the year of 2008, Yuen Chi Dai Gwan 元始帝君　had appeared in the altar again and stated a mission to both Tin-Si. Yuen Chi Dai Gwan　元始帝君 said that Taoism have been in China for more than 5000 years now but was never exposed to the western civilization. Therefore, Yuen Chi Dai Gwan　元始帝君 told both Tin-Si to broaden Taoism throughout the western culture and use Taoism to heal and rescue the sufferings in the western culture for the coming days. After Yuen Chi Dai Gwan 元始帝君　is finished with the speech, a gold light immediately shines at the back of both Tin-Si. Both Tin-Si turned their head back and saw nothing. When they turn their head back to the altar again, everybody was gone. Both Tin-Si greet with a humble bow and light incense to thanks Yuen Chi Dai Gwan 元始帝君for granting the mission. After they put the incense in the incense pot, a bubble of white smoke arose and formed a shape in the air. The shape looks like a stamp, revealing the words of NG YIN DO PAI　悟然道派 inside. Then on, both Tin-Si were granted the branches of NG YIN DO PAI 悟然道派 in Taoism and that is when the journey of spreading the word of Taoism starts.
======================

So, back in 2003 or so Mak Jo Si said he was being trained directly by the Deity 'Luk Yam Sin Si', and that it was this Deity that granted the name "Chi in Nature" for their alter. Take note that this is the very same Deity that Mak Jo Si is now claiming was made up by the Luk Yam Shen Gong sect, and which Mak Jo Si is now actively attacking and disparaging. Are people getting the real picture now? Mak Jo Si can't even seem to make up his mind if the Deity "Luk Yam Sin Si" is his direct teacher who granted him the 'Chi in Nature' name and directly trained him, or if this is a made up Deity from a scammer sect! It just doesn't get more messed up than that. Mak Jo Si obviously has some very serious credibility issues, to say the least.

Also notice that Mak Jo Si also stated how he supposedly came up with the name for his previous Taoist sect " NG YIN DO PAI".


Mak Jo Si wrote the following in a discussion forum a few years later:
(see post #: 12)
quote:
==============================
" "Ng Yin Do Pai" was officially destroyed on 2009/9/23 by us. This is becvause the lineage founder Mak Ching Yuen and Lau Ching Sin have got scam by a scam leading to a mistake on the lineage name and the poem. This then lead to the period when both lineage founder became and granted the title of Celestial Master, they destroy the lineage themselves. That is the rule they have states back then " In Taoism you cannot have any self-claimed lineage of magic or lineage, or magic. Everything must be passed down by the deities to be active. Their lineage void this rule and so is destroyed. Who void it will have 3 years cannot get back into Taoism and that's the rule." Because Ng Yin Do Pai WAS passed on to the two people by deities, but because at that time, the two celestial masters were mislead by a scammer, changed the name of the lineage and the poem, and so the lineage void this rule. Initially, Ng Yin Do Pai lineage is from the deities, but is should be "Kin Kwan Wan Yuen Pai" The Lineage poem is "Kin Kwan Tung Tin Dei, Yuen Yuen Mo Jai Bin, Dak Jung Sam Ching Jing, Chin Goo Wing Lau Chuen" . But the two Celestial Master listened to the scammer and changed the poem and so the lineage is not fully from heaven anymore, and then the lineage poem is then a self-made one then. So void this rule and was destroyed."
=========================

So, Mak Jo Si later admitted that his original statement about the origin of the sect name " Ng Yin Do Pai" was not true, and that Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si had derived this name from another person who they were involved with at the time, who Mak Jo Si now refers to as a 'scammer' as well. So, Mak Jo Si admitted to not telling the truth about the origin of the " Ng Yin Do Pai" lineage name for the 'sect' he created, and for the lineage poem as well. If he admitted to not telling the truth about something as key as that to his whole original 'Taoist sect', what else do you think Mak Jo Si might not be telling the truth about? He also can't even gets his facts straight about whether the Deity 'Luk Yam Sin Si' was one of his direct teachers and guides, or if 'Luk Yam Sin Si' is just made up by a scam cult. It is time Mak Jo Si's followers wise up to the truth, and the truth is not very pretty at all.

Now Mak Jo Si is stating that his new Taoist sect is a true and pure Taoist sect, and that this new sect ('Tin Yat' sect) was also granted to him by a new Deity in a similar manner to before. Mak Jo Si has also stated various other things that most reasonable people realize right off are quite questionable as well. Sorry to be so blunt, but people need to be aware of the facts in regards to Mak Jo Si and his self proclaimed Taoist sects and claims to being a Taoist Master. I hope that now that the facts are out in the open people will beging to think carefully about continuing to lend any support to Mak Jo Si's ongoing attack campaigns on the internet. In my opinion, if anyone is running an 'evil scammer cult' it would be Mak Jo Si himself. The facts to back this up are listed clearly and plainly above, and the facts are undeniable. Anyone who still has any doubts can check out the weblinks I posted above for them self.

flo wrote:i can't believe this guy already has 4 accounts here and is spamming massive walls of text



does :lol:work here? o.O

"This guy" got 4 accounts here? You talking about me? Got proof and evidence of those accounts are 'mine"? Maybe you need to do an ip check (or can you, are you the owner of the forum?). I hate it when people start putting too much thoughts into things and pretending they are smarties, if you think you are, sure, please give me some proof and evidence - don't act like those people who are defaming us, making up hoax and shit, because that is just too.... low.

My students and I are all up here, using our REAL identity to talk. If you dare to speak without a mask but your true name, I would love to see that. Real or fake, it's really obvious, you wanna ask the admin to check up on our IP and stuff? Sure, but prepare for another epic fail meal. I don't do those shit sneaky stuff, you know?

StandsForTruth wrote:First off, I would like to say hello to all.

The following is fairly long, but I think it is important for anyone who wants to know more about the actual facts
about Mak Jo Si and his 'Taoist sect' to read through the following. I have actually left out some details to try to
........posted above for them self.

StandsForTruth? What's the truth? The truth is, another Wilson Yong people here trying to wear a mask and talk like shit. You got guts to use a real face to talk? Or, are you Wilson Yong by any chance? If yes, I would love to see your face too. Or we can talk here.

First off, I said already, I welcome QUESTIONS of any sorts to clear any confusion, miscommunications, and rumors. Things like what you quote are all known, seen and heard by all my students, and they all know the answers to that. There is nothing wrong there, and if you do really ask, I am willing to answer. Since you are Wilson Yong's people, then I don't see a point of answering too much - AT FIRST.

But now, let me give you a few free lesson, maybe you will understand more, or just fight back without using your brain to think about it. From what I read, your really didn't read what I posted for so long.

"A couple of years ago approximately I noticed that Mak Jo Si began to post attacks against various religions and Taoist and Buddhist sects. Mak Jo Si's attacks were for the most part quite ridiculous, basically......."

When did I "attack" these sects and religion? Where? If you are talking about the bad paths which Wilson Yong's student quoted - then you better get a life. Those things are posted in a PAGE inside my website or my blog only, you know, Christianity say every religion is evil too, and so? They are just like us here now, talking in our OWN place, and who the hell is so nosy to come and think it's their business to even care about a guy who doesn't agree to these religion? What's the problem with these nosy people? Huh? Anything wrong with not agreeing with other religions? There is freedom of speech and I can disagree anything I want and say it in my own place, so?

"When I became aware in the last little while that Mak Jo Si was launching a major attack campaign against Wilson Yong on the internet, I did a search on Wilson Yong's name and found that a whole........Wilson Yong,"

Those blogs are created by people who supported me and fought back for debunking stuff, and why the hell do I need or have to type so many "blogs" since I have my own Taoist Masters Blog? Major attacking CAMPAIGN? Ya, maybe our debunking campaign to the cults like Luk Yam, but not to Wilson Yong. You see taoleaks.org? That my campaign, and I never direct at Wilson Yong but just the scam cults because those are the big things I am focused on. If you even pay attention to my blog's post, you can see that I had even comply with Wilson Yong's lawyer's letter FIRST to help him contact Au Yeung Fuk Lee in Hong Kong and have him remove the WHOLE BLOG which is more than what Wilson Yong's Lawyer is asking for. (They only asked to remove a few links as quoted). I know that is too nice and Wilson Yong's Lawyer came back without a thank you but demand WAY more blogs and shit that weren't even mine and expect me to delete everything. Oh fuck it, and I am not going to comply with such a stupid person's reply, you see, those are not mine, you stupid or mindfuck? How can I remove them? Fuck it! You think that something look alike = the same person? So anyone who got a dick is your father then? If you keep on blaming me, the result is, all those fans and believers out there are going hate Wilson Yong more for his actions because he is too crazy greedy and nasty, and ya, who the hell cares about just this one guy at first if he is not that nasty huh?


"If we also consider Mak Jo Si's obsession with guns and knives, and using guns on his alter and for part of his 'Taoist magic' rituals, it becomes more obvious that something is very wrong here...."

Okay, so having swords and stuff is okay, but guns and knives is not. You can believe so and that is your point of view, but keep in mind that closed minded people cannot accept anything new, because your mind is enclosed. That's all. If you read or even spend time to read, we have explained it here already and your point doesn't make a damn sense.

As for Ng Yin Do Pai, I think my students and I can explain it better but then I don't think you will even read anyway, so I will cut my typing here and stop typing to a wall.

Overall, I would say that you are really blindfolded or brainwashed by Wilson Yong and you don't read the timeline at all. Wilson Yong is again playing the innocent like he is the good guy all along and all those defamatory stuff he did to attack us didn't happen, Wow what a guy. I am here speaking with a real face and identity, you are hiding being your monitor and with a mask on, that surely shows who is speaking the "truth" and who is just trying to wave shit in the air and polluting the place.

Anyone beside this "Truth" bullshit got questions, I welcome you to ask, I will answer it for you if you are coming for good intention and not wasting your and my time by re-typing all those crap again and not even reading a word from me. Thank you. Before you type, I suggest you do read over stuff I posted here first, on all the threads. Your answers might be there already.

NOTE: All my students are here to answer questions, clear doubts and also bring out the truth because they are the one that witnessed everything and can speak out to show you guys what we are really about. They are all real people with a real face and name, and those are NOT my account. If you want to accuse me for that, provide evidence before going like Wilson Yong's mode again, blaming me for shit that I haven't do. You know, it really proved something when you do these kinda stupid moves.

Standsfortruth

Um... May I ask in what way Wilson Yong should be considered professional? Professional in Taoism? Buddhism? Accounting? Rubber business? Beauty products?
 
Wilson Yong's lawyers were quick to respond at the beginning but seem to have disappeared after Mak Jo Si's second reply. What is the reason? Maybe you could find out the answer from him?
 
Re allegations made against Wilson Yong on the various blogs, one should easily see, if read with care, that they all have been supported with facts after extensive research.
 
Will any of those allegations ever be answered? Why is he linked to fake diplomas? Why is he connected to fake schools and universities?

Isn't it pretty clear who's hiding / not revealing the truth, StandsForTruth?

StandsForTruth wrote:... I have communicated with Wilson Yong a few times through email over the past few years in regards to questions I had about Taoist services he provides through his website, and also in regards to general questions I had. Although he is often extremely busy, Wilson Yong has always taken time to reply to my emails and get back to me. ... Anyone who still has any doubts can check out the weblinks I posted above for them self.

I have communicated with Mak Jo Si for more than 6000 times and I know Mak Jo Si is a good person, unlike Wilson Yong, PERIOD. So what? Oh, I see! You are a person of Wilson Yong. Siao kia...

From what this guy 'Standsfortruth' talking about, he doesnt know whats Real and Pure Taoism compare to mixup Taoism. Mak Jo Si history in his transformation from what he have learned from young till now finding the True Taoism, its throught experience and hardship to find the Truth.
I have been student in Tin Yat lineage for 9 months and have seen my life transformed from shit problem to improvement to even better life and health. This is the my proof.
Talking about slandering Wilson Yong as main target, this is not particularly what Mak Jo Si intention as he want to highlight the dark secret of whatever sects esp now about Luk Yam to let the public aware of whats going on inside the sect. Its just that Wilson Yong is in the limelight is because his blog n website do show that his Taoism background is also a mixup into other religions.Anyone have the rights to voice their opinion and pinpoint to others the misinterpretation or misrepresentation of the website to the public So is there anything wrong with that? After all Mak Jo Si have show his research evidences of what he found out. So its not allegations or unfounded truth of Wilson Yong.

Mak Jo Si is 29, almost 30 years old, but Wilson Yong is 39 this year. How come he is bullying a person that is 10 years younger than him? It's like a father bullying the son's friend and saying he want to sue them. HAHAHAHAHA! So everyone you can see what kind of person Wilson Yong is. Very polite, very good guy, very son of a bitch.

Thank you all for your support and comments. Honestly, I don't see why for me to talk about how our lineage view other religion on our own website = attacking other religion. If that's the case, our lineage have been attacked for a long long time already. That Wilson Yong created the blog with false shit and defamed me, and THAT is attacking because he even brew up his blog by using the name "Taoist Master(S) Blog" which is totally trying to aim at my blog's name "Taoist Master Blog". This is very professional, ya he is, professional at doing these things like changing one character of something and call it his own creation.

Wilson Yong's company in UK for inventing the hair loss product is "Resvitol Ltd" and there is actually an international company "Revitol International Corp". Why is it just one "S" difference?

Wilson Yong's creation of TRX9 the hair loss spray thing, well you cannot find anything on it except TRX9.org which is a porn site..? But there is a legit product there named TRX2 which is someone else creation before him and that is a pill or something.

Having said that, the Taoist Master(S) Blog and Taoist Master Blog...

Everything is just like that, he LOVE adding and subtracting tiny details - just like how it's done in China "Microsoft VS Micosoft" or "PayPal vs PayPol" or "Gucci VS Cucci", etc. Nice tactic, it illustrates his professionalism so well in these kinda stuff. Honestly, when did I use such a lame tactic like this? I have did, I would just wanna kill myself for making a joke out of myself already.

Oh ya, he is 10 years older than me! Good point Tin Sun! So we should be scared of Uncle Yong cuz he is older. He got big people to sue your ass off and we might be dragged to Malaysia to get our ass whipped too, becareful, Malaysia's "cane" punishment is VERY scary! HAHAHAHAHAA!

Standsfortruth,

You are obviously a good hearted, smart person who simply wants to get to the bottom of things.

Unfortunately, religious traditions have learned to take advantage of such mindsets.

Jo Si's Taoism has helped me see the problems inherent in most religious systems. One of the biggest and most embarrassing problems that he has encountered is the popular belief in China that magic can make people blade proof and bullet proof.

Traditions such as these lead to the downfall of China from which it still has not recovered. So he's very passionate about getting the word out on this and related topics.

Traditions such as Buddhism and communism sound nice to people but are actually ruinous if implemented seriously.

I don't know much about Wilson Yong but he strikes me as that sort of religious teacher who wants to be seen as compassionate and kindly but whose actions betray as yet another spiritual scammer.

I'm striving to address the problems of religion at taoism101.wordpress.com

-Tin Yang

Yoda wrote:Standsfortruth,

You are obviously a good hearted, smart person .....I'm striving to address the problems of religion at taoism101.wordpress.com

-Tin Yang

Tin Yang, you are really doing a good job with your blog, I enjoy reading it too! If people ever go to China and see the real China today, then they will know how bad communist country is. I think you can report some of those stuff on your blog too! Fun to read your research! Enjoy your stay here! Keep talking in alien language and waving the light saber around!

StandsForTruth

do you have any coupon for a good bottle of aspirin please ? your text gave me a headache with the wall of text you putted up. i didn't know someone could make brick with bullsh*t for the wall by the way

i'm sorry (not really) but i don't believe you at all. and i doubt that you place is around here, if you don't believe in what we do.

Just to chill off abit from the fire, maybe I should start another informative posting in this thread to make the place better for reading. Here I want to talk about the issue of "Why Taoism is not FREE-to-dig".

My example is - like a computer university that teach you how to use computer for many things.

Taoism is like that, especially when I am talking about Tin Yat Lineage. It's a massive system of knowledge, and it is not something you can get on your own NOR gain access to your "intranet" with all the stuff too.

Some people say - oh I think Taoism, nature, etc... should be "free".

Well so you wanna go from scratch and make your motherboard, ram, and powercord and all those stuff JUST because you wanna go cheap and want things "free"? Do you realize the "free" is not so "free" at all? Those raw materials cost a lot if you buy it yourself, and also to process them and make them into something usable.. AND you need to have those machine to make those board functional too - given that you are a genius and can figure out how those board actually works....

So thinking about it that way, seeing so many westerners thinking they can "get" Taoism on their own.. I just don't know how or where to start to introduce them the real thing - and yes, it always shatter their dream and they go SNAP at me.

I am raising this point here because I want to clear this misunderstanding and confusion people have with my speech on my blog or websites. If anyone got questions or something you wanna say about this point, please feel free to say it here. I will try my best to clear things up for you!

To Mak Jo Si and his followers here, I have not said that I am associated with Wilson Yong. I have actually made it clear that I have just communicated a bit with him via email over the last several years, and I gave my own personal impression of Wilson Yong based on those interactions. It is quite telling that Mak Jo Si and some of his followers posting here are now labelling me as 'one of Wilson Yong's people'. Do you folks really not care at all whether anything you say has any basis in truth and reality at all? That's very sad. I am not connected with Wilson Yong in any way other than how I have described, which is just having exchanged some emails with him in the past. From my perspective Wilson Yong has only been taking steps to defend himself against ongoing attacks and slander by Mak Jo Si and now also by some of Mak Jo Si's followers. From what I have observed, Wilson Yong did nothing to warrant these ongoing attacks and slander from you folks. When he tries to defend himself, this is turned around by you folks as 'Wilson attacking you'. I am sorry to say it, but what you are doing is very typical cult behavior, and is not only completely uncalled for here from what I have observed, but it is just downright nasty as well.

So far, neither Mak Jo Si or his followers have commented on how Mak Jo Si originally claimed that the Deity 'Luk Yam Sin Si' originally appeared to Mak Jo Si and Lau Jo Si in golden light and taught them and guided them and assisted them, and gave then the name 'Chi in Nature' for their Taoist alter, and how Mak Jo Si deceived his followers about how he came up with the name "Ng Ying Do Pai' and the associated lineage poem, and how now Mak Jo Si is now claiming that the Deity 'Luk Yam Sin Si' was just 'made up' by a scammer cult. Which statements by Mak Jo Si are true and which statements are false?

I am fully aware that some Taoist sects have influences and combine practices from both Buddhism and Taoism, and some even have influences from Confuscianism as well. Some of these sects are very well respected in China and have been so for many years now, including the Quanzhen sect, for example. I know that Wilson Yong also seems to combine both Buddhist and Taoist practices. That in itself is certainly no reason to launch nasty attack and smear campaigns however. It is one thing to not approve of others views based on your own views and beliefs, but to launch nasty attack and smear campaigns is quite uncalled for, and as I have mentioned such behavior is quite typical behavior of cults and extremists of all sorts. It is not enough for cultists and extremists to simply just disagree or disapprove, they must go on the attack and never do they let facts stand in the way of their nasty assaults.

Go ahead and launch your attacks against me if you must and if it makes you feel better, but in this case I think the truth needed to be made clear. Gnash your teeth and spin your webs of deception, but the truth remains the truth for any who care to see.

StandsForTruth wrote:To Mak Jo Si and his followers here, I......ut in this case I think the truth needed to be made clear. Gnash your teeth and spin your webs of deception, but the truth remains the truth for any who care to see.

StandsForTruth,

Actually we are not saying you are denying your connection with Wilson Yong, but in fact, I think that just because you had a FEW email conversations with Wilson Yong over the past few MONTHS, it is really telling us that you know about this man "very well". LOL! A few emails over the past few months, that is "A LOT" of conversation you got there. You really make sense!

Obviously you didn't read my post, or else you would already know the answer of what you are trying to say about my lineage and my past experience. I do not mind if people ask me politely AND ALSO READ MY RESPOND. But then, for you? I can see that you don't even read, so why wast the time and energy to type more?

I don't know why you just so want to jam in here and talk shit. Maybe you are in love with Wilson Yong or something and you feel you want to be the batman saving this guy. Hell, that's not what we care though, all we care is, we were posting on our OWN websites, and never touch him at all, directly. HE was the one who only did directly send in an attack with his BLAMing lawyer's letter FIRST and physically attacked and harassed me with that shit. Your brain might not be large enough to digest the logic but I suggest you really draw a timeline and see who attack who first before you blindly follow his brainwashing so called evidence and facts.

Also, your English is just so laughable, when did I "slandered" Wilson Yong? You got a dictionary? Please, consult your lawyer before making such claims of what I did. I never slandered him and you are accusing me of doing these things which I have not done. Just like Wilson Yong did, all the time. Gosh. Make your facts straight before you speak further - and hijacking my thread here again. Shit man, why am I am typing all these things to a wall?

[quote="StandsForTruth I am not connected with Wilson Yong in any way other than how I have described, which is just having exchanged some emails with him in the past. From my perspective Wilson Yong has only been taking steps to defend himself against ongoing attacks and slander by Mak Jo Si and now also by some of Mak Jo Si's followers.




[/quote]
StandsForTruth

It is unfortunate that you didn't seem to have read our replies or other materials.

As for the definition of slander or libel, you can find it easily on the internet -

"Blacks’ Law Dictionary defines defamation as an “intentional, unprivileged, false communication, either published or publically spoken, that injures another’s reputation or good name.”  Yet, defamation is more than it may seem as it includes the common law torts of libel and slander – libel being written defamation and slander being spoken or oral defamation. When discussing defamation in general terms, it is commonly described as a knowingly untrue statement tending to “to diminish the esteem, respect, goodwill or confidence in which [the defamed person] is held, or to excite adverse, derogatory, or unpleasant feelings or opinions against him.”

(shipso.com/defamation_law.php)

As you can see such statement has to be untrue, not supported by facts and not categorised as "fair comment".

Wilson Yong's claim letter simply didn't fulfill these basic requirements and of course I assume that's why Mak Jo Si has not heard from him again, let alone the fact that the letter was addressed to the wrong person.

On the other hand, Mak Jo Si and his fans have been presenting facts about Wilson Yong for the public to judge for themselves. Please note that hey do not call someone "scammer", "con artist", "fraudster" lightly even it is so common to see people tend to abuse these words nowadays.

Let me give you an example of what we consider as scam (even it has been repeated elsewhere):
Blade proof scam - if you mislead someone to believe that blade proof is a type of magic that you can teach in consideration of a certain sum of money (large or small), while in reality it is just a silly trick, are you not deceiving people for money then? (Hmmm I think blade proof/bullet proof is one of the things that Wilson Yong promotes?)

Of course it is up to you to choose not to believe in these obvious facts.

Sorry clicked "send" by mistake for the previous post without typing anything!

Mak Jo Si, I have said that I communicated with Wilson Yong through email over several years, not several months, and I have said I am not connected with Wilson Yong in any way beyond that. I have not communicated with Wilson Yong for quite some time now. You say you only write your views on your own websites, but in reality you and/or your followers and associates have posted your attacks on various websites and blogs and youtube. It is just one false statement after another with you. This really is very sad.

So, you still have not explained why you for several years stated that you were learning from the Deity "Luk Yam Sin Si" who would appear to you in golden light and teach and assist you and Lau Jo Si, and whom you claimed led you to Lau Jo Si and gave you the name of "Chi in Nature", which you still use. Then how you later claimed that you deceived your followers about how you actually came up with this name "Ng Yin Do Pai" and assocaited lineage poem, and how you now are claiming that the Deity "Luk Yam Sin Si" was just made up by a scammer cult sect, and you are actively carrying on an internet attack campaign against that sect and Deity. Would you care to explain all this, or will you continue to just side step these questions and continue your attacks and untruths?

Perhaps you were mislead by evil spirits posing as Deities when you created your first 'Taoist' sect and declared yourself to be a 'Taoist Master', which you claimed then was true and pure Taoism. Now you have done the exact same thing again with your fairly recently created "Tin Yat" sect, in which you also claim that a different Taoist Deity has communicated with you and granted you the new sect and made you leader of this new sect as well. You also again claim that this new sect is true and pure Taoism, just as you did with your previous "Ng Yin Do Pai" sect. So, was it that evil spirits or whatever fooled both you and Lau Jo Si by posing as Deities the first time, but this time you have it right and you are really being guided by a true Taoist Deity? A Taoist Deity who stands by and allows you to run the reputation of true Taoism and other religions into the ground with all your shameful ativities and untruths. What a strange and scary place heaven must be to have Deities that would condone such reprehensible behaviour. Or is it that you continue to be led down the garden path, or have you just been making it all up as you go along as you admitted having done with your "Ng Yin Do Pai" name and lineage poem? Reasonable and clear thinking people who respect truth can only be left to wonder. I hope at some point you can come to terms with the truth and stop your attacks against others in attempts to try to shift blame and responsibility from yourself to others. I really do wish you
all the best however.

May the pursuit of truth and compassion for all living beings be our guide.